The Psychology of Customer Service Apologies

This brief Wisdom app talk on March 3rd looks at the psychology of apologies, especially pertaining to those in Customer Service followed by a call-in chat with Malcolm who relates first hand experience working in this field.

My edited notes:

• wondered why I felt off when apologized to by many Customer Service representatives so I investigated
• not addressing apologies amongst friends
• not saying Customer Service reps shouldn’t apologize either
• based on perceiving an issue
• reflexive, push button, surface level reaction
• contains one (another) to surface level
• distances one emotionally

• psychological tactic of gauging emotional response to apology
• on upside it forces a moment of a type of mindfulness
• how then is such knowledge used? To get the upper-hand emotionally? If so, how?
• inverted cover for Schadenfreude for some
• why do some say one thing, mean another, then do something entirely differently?
• response of impotency or perceived impotency — sometimes neither one can (or wants) to take action, or can do anything, or concludes the other party can’t do anything
• can be a groundless conclusion of limitation
• on the upside, it’s an opportunity to acknowledge and appreciate ourselves as frustration is often a prompting for this
• Possible response:
  • Apologize for their apology:
    • I’m sorry that you’re sorry
    • I apologize for your apology

---

The raw unedited YouTube transcription of this podcast:

from integrating presence

and this talk is mostly going to be

about the psychology of customer service

apologies you know we’ve all been in

situations we’re calling customer

support or we’re you know we’re on the

phone or we’re speaking to someone in

person too

and it gets to the point where they say

well i apologize for such and such i’m

i’m sorry or not really sorry it’s just

oh i apologize for that you know um

so for me that was kind of like

it didn’t really sit well all of a

sudden

uh for most most part it does it just

there’s something about it so i was

wondering what that was all about like

what’s going on here why do i like feel

this way or kind of throws up a red flag

but i didn’t really know what was going

on

so i sat down and i investigated this

kind of look more deeply into it now

this is obviously my own opinion

my own insights my own view on this my

own thoughts

based on my feeling and experience so

obviously i’m not saying this is the

truth or this is the way it is for

everybody all the time

um but this is kind of

what i’ve

arrived at some of these short insights

here and i’m not talking about sincere

apologies amongst friends not at all

because we all know the power of a

sincere apology and when it’s impactful

and needed and then sometimes when it’s

being withheld and then finally given

i’m not talking about that and i’m not

saying don’t do this either i’m not

saying that if you work in customer

service that you should just stop

apologizing all together not saying that

either

necessarily but to start this off

um with with customer services customer

service representatives apologizing it’s

it’s first off it’s based on a perceived

issue which a lot of times um the other

person

addressing something they perceive an

issue and it’s pretty clear

but

sometimes i know in my experience i’m

just reporting certain things and i

don’t look at it as a problem or an

issue even anything that needs to be

fixed i just kind of like oh this is my

observation you know you can do with

this observation what you want you don’t

have to do anything with it or no

but for the most part from what i gather

when somebody apologizes in customer

service

there’s an issue they’re perceiving an

issue they think there’s something wrong

and this is almost like a reflexive

push button surface level reaction right

it’s almost scripted i’m sure there’s

some customer service reps that do this

countless times a day and i’ve even had

ones that just you know over and over

again apologize so there’s not really

much thought or feeling

it’s just kind of like a routine

scripted thing

it’s really on the surface level it

makes sense because to one extent for

them to do it because it distance ones

one emotionally i mean i couldn’t even

imagine being a customer service editor

and having people call and complain and

probably be irate maybe take out a lot

of stuff on them too i get it if they

can just automatically say i’m sorry or

i apologize for that even if it’s just

kind of just a canned response it will

distance them emotionally from the other

person so they don’t have to take on

their crap so i get that it’s also a

psychological tactic of gauging an

emotional response to

an apology so once the person says i

apologize well then

it kind of on the upside forces a moment

of mindfulness for the other person and

then the customer service

representatives can kind of gauge

what their emotional response is once

that apology comes if it changes

then they can go from there like if if

it helps then they can defuse a

situation or

you know if it does something else and

they can kind of see a different side or

a different

kind of emotional response once that’s

there or not so it’s kind of throws a

fork in the road perhaps

so once that happens once they get kind

of a gauge on how the person responds to

the apology then they’re going to get

some kind of knowledge there about the

person’s kind of emotional intelligence

and the situation

probably get a brief change a lot of

times

and then so how is that knowledge used

how’s the customer service

representative going to use that

knowledge once they apologize how the

other person changes their response

are they going to use it to get the

upper hand emotionally on the person

calling in or talking or wanting help or

service or reporting something and then

if they are going to try to get the

upper hand emotionally how how do they

do that

now on the kind of the really dark side

of this it can be kind of an inverted

apologizing like this can

a cover an inverted cover for schroding

freudia for salmon sword shot and

freudia is a german word for

deriving joy and satisfaction from the

pain and suffering and things going

wrong for others

and so if they’re actually feeling that

they can kind of mask that or cover that

by giving up you know a shallow apology

now hopefully none of you will ever have

to experience that but anything that’s

out there and which brings me to my next

point i’ve had a teacher might put this

this way and i just fascinates me

why do some people say one thing

but mean another

and then do something else entirely

different it just flabbergasted me

coming up being pretty much honest my

entire life and just don’t seem really

the point of lying and then trying to

have to keep track of lies and then

trying to be weasel out of things

snakey-like and it would kind of

infuriate me once it was put like this

it just kind of cleared up a bunch of

things that but i just don’t know why

this happened well i have some really

kind of deep metaphysical

speculation or things i could repeat but

i won’t hear why people will a lot of

people will say one thing but mean

another

and then do something else entirely but

just put just put like that

gave me a lot of added clarity about how

a significant portion of people operate

in the world

are used to anyway hopefully

so another thing with this customer

service apology

it’s kind of a response of in potency

are perceived in potency by this i mean

neither one

can or wants to take action

so they just kind of want to a lot of

times voice you know whatever they they

want and then

the person

calling into customer service or talking

about customer service it’s like they

can’t do anything so that’s why they’re

they’re calling and

either asking for some kind of action or

some kind of response

taken well sometimes though when when

the person when the customer service rep

apologizes then they can actually they

can take action but a lot of times

that’s all they can do is apologize or

can sometimes

conclude

that the other person can’t do anything

it is important to do anything that’s

calling in

but that’s sometimes not the case

sometimes it is

so yeah that’s another big murky gray

area

it’s kind of like a groundless

conclusion for limitation in that sense

when that happens i wonder if a

solution to this or maybe a different

approach might be to

i know some people really like apologies

but

what if they led with action like

well here’s what we’re going to do

are asking what the other person would

like to have done

and then seeing what kind of compromise

can be had i’m not 100 sure on this but

bright sides of this

is this is an opportunity to acknowledge

and appreciate ourselves

because frustration is often a prompting

for this

so a lot of times when i know when i’m

calling in to customer service and

there’s some kind of frustration

involved a lot of times this means that

i feel i’m being underappreciated or

undervalued sometimes i’m not even

conscious that i’m reaching out for this

external kind of value and validation

kind of in respect and honor too trying

to get it from the outside instead of

just taking a moment and offering that

to myself right because nobody’s gonna

be able to give that level of value

validation honor respect that can come

from internally right

because no one knows us better than

ourselves what i did though is i tried

this a couple times now after they said

oh i apologize i said well i apologize

for your apology or i said i’m sorry

that you’re sorry and all of a sudden it

just like

a light went on in them and they’re just

like oh it just kind of got more real

and sincere after that

because i guess it just kind of i don’t

know disrupted kind of standard

programming or scripting that goes along

with this yeah it was just the kind of

superficial

barrier that was there that

they’re used to dealing not they but you

know the customer service rep is kind of

on autopilot

dealing with

whatever they deal with all day long

and then something like this comes along

and then it just turned

kind of more personal after

i said that right it just become kind of

more authentic

conversation after that

so it’s really kind of an interesting

response i got when i said i apologize

for your apology

i’m sorry that you’re sorry

so i kind of included them instead of

you know the standard dynamic there

well i think that’s going to do it for

this brief talk on the psychology of

customer service apologies oh well we

got a guest here hey i know you were on

the tail end of um of leaving but i i

was like oh i gotta catch this topic i i

really hate

telling of it didn’t mean to take any

more time but i won’t take too much of

your time but you’re perfect your title

really sparked my interest because

it’s

with customer service becoming more

intrusive in today’s world people

people’s um

what’s the way i can the patience is is

just not there as it once used to be

because with companies like spectrum

directv

[Music]

most of these telemarketers they they go

through quite a hassle but when it’s in

retail as well people expect that

that it kind of like a subservient

attitude from

um from people that work at these these

um these wholesale and retail uh places

as well and it becomes

as if you have to um adhere to all their

demands but

what you were mentioning and i called

the tail end of what you were speaking

about um i i wanted you to to elaborate

uh more on

what what how did you break the barrier

of the traditional apology and were you

the recipient or were you the person

that was giving giving it

yeah you know what you said was so

important too about this kind of the

general climate and um

environment of customer service and how

the subservience that really stuck out

for me you know um

yeah they’re they’re almost expected to

kind of yeah be subservient to every and

it’s just like well what does that do to

one’s kind of

empowerment and you know um

kind of

the take action side that’s it’s it’s a

really interesting dynamic right that’s

something else to explore on its own but

to your question of how did i uh

how did i break through that barrier you

know because i have a really um

regular meditation practice

i have since 2012 a daily practice and

so a lot of times i’ll just

part of the practice i’ll just sit and

i’ll drop in questions and i’ll

investigate this you just drop a

question in and then um the mind just

kind of goes to work on it and we’ll

come back with an answer a lot of times

once work the mind is actually kind of

quiet

and settled down um

and so it can it can go to work on that

and one thing that just came through was

you know um

i apologize for your apology

so that you know i was i was coming with

was under a lot of stress recently well

not a lot but for me a lot because most

of my life is pretty smooth right

so when i was moving um i i had some

things

i won’t go into details here but you

know a couple times from two different

people

really cool people too

it’s just when they said they apologize

and it was just like this is you know

coming from standard autopilot and it

just seems like an okay way to operate

right and we’re all used to receiving a

lot of apologies throughout the day and

again like i said at the beginning it’s

it’s i’m not talking about sincere

apologies here between friends where

they’re really needed right and

sometimes put off and then um gotten

later and they’re really appreciated i’m

not talking about those i’m just talking

about the standard regurgitation of

apologies and so i tried this you know

this this insight of

you know i why apologize for your

apology

and it just kind of gave them a pause

and i guess they’ve never heard anything

like that because i had neither you know

and

i don’t know what happened or

what but it just kind of like diffused

and all this kind of kind of posturing

and surface level

you know way of we interacting in the

world just kind of fell away and then

you know i was able to share things more

personally and real and authentically in

a more kind way and and likewise too the

other the other two were able to do the

same you know

and they were actually looking for kind

of care and concern as well you know

from me and so i was able to reciprocate

at least i felt like i was anyway so

yeah

wow that’s really interesting psychology

um because

if i were an angry customer and you were

to say i apologize for your apology i’m

not gonna lie it would throw me off

tremendously and then i would of course

prob more than likely be curious as to

what you would say following that

considering the context or perhaps the

severity of of the issue that i’m

frustrated with because i think

some people want to have their feelings

well no most people want to have their

feelings validated right and

i feel as though you saying that would

open up more dialogue for you to speak

with them and to diffuse uh potential

hostility oh it don’t it totally did and

for me

uh for whatever reason maybe it’s just a

misperception on my part but when i hear

this i’m sorry for this i apologize it

just doesn’t feel really sincere to me

you know and i guess some people aren’t

looking for sincerity right they just

want to hear this apology that’s great

if that works for them i say go for it

that’s that’s that’s great but for me it

just it almost kind of just like um

in a way for me

that i’m so into authenticity and

sincerity it’s almost like kicking

somebody when they’re down if they don’t

eat it you know you know what i mean

so but

yeah so that’s just yeah so i you know i

wonder i i don’t i can’t really

say everybody go out and try this you

know but if you feel called to

um if you’re curious and you feel called

to try it out maybe

folks out there listening could consider

this you know um

i don’t know so like i can’t you know i

can’t really off i can’t really advise

it i can’t really advise against it so

it’s

whoever’s call you know use discernment

right of course and i would only hope

people don’t try to say it in a

sarcastic way because i can see how that

would go south really oh yeah and i was

totally borderline on that you know

because it’s just kind of like a

sarcastic um response in general but in

a way it’s

maybe it can be um perceived as

sarcasm to point out sarcasm in in a way

you know our sarcasm to point out in

sincerity just kind of a brief wake-up

call now i don’t really support sarcasm

you know unless you’re a teenager just

experience experimenting with sarcasm

right you know or a bad sitcom or

something like that and i was really

challenged on this for a long time you

know and that’s to this day i still have

trouble giving sincere

compliments because i was at the point

where i was so inverted that i was

giving these underhanded compliments

that were actually insults you know

that’s how bad i was at one point so wow

yeah you know so i’m still working on

that too

well the sad thing is is that when you

work in an environment full of people

that are condescending a-holes

it kind of makes it a a much more

difficult uh environment for you to you

know of course excellent yes

you’re not kidding me you know and then

the condescending thing that would

really push my buttons for the longest

time too

and and again you know the condescension

is similar along these lines too it’s an

emotional distancing right it’s this

perception that oh i’m better than so

and so and so i have to distance myself

so i don’t have to feel what they’re

feeling or i don’t have to feel what i’m

uh

feeling uh when i’m condescending to

somebody that distance me from myself

from have to

feel and go through these uncomfortable

you know stuff and face myself right

so that’s that’s the kind of psychology

of condescension i feel yeah it’s like

uh reverse psychology

times 10. yeah

yeah

it’s it’s something it’s something else

it truly is but i think um things that

i’ve learned when i was in customer

service was just uh

i can’t i just need to work on my

reaction when i hear because of course

condescension translates to you know

being an a-hole so of course you can

already perceive that right off the bat

and now it’s the response that you give

back to equal or greater but i don’t

like to make it a passive aggressive

competition to be who to who can be more

condescending so i just i uh sometimes

when i when i was um given uh presented

with condescension i would just uh be

very subtle in a way that would uh

indicate that i was i don’t know i was i

was very subtle with my responses

because i had to obviously choose my

words wisely so i would just

i guess i would probably give the same

kind of energy back so

it kind of it was kind of like me

mirroring that energy but it helped

because i kind of held my own for the

time being especially because i was you

know over here on the phones and stuff

like that speaking of people over the

phone so because i didn’t actually see

these people

in in person i mean i did when i was

working in retail but when i switched to

on the phones and stuff like that it

gave me that much that a lot more

leisure but i think the the important

thing here is just to uh

to find a way to combat that so that you

can diffuse that and continue on with

what it is that you have to do as far as

to getting past that because you know

you don’t want to dwell on that because

only it only makes it even worse and

then of course it gives them more fuel

when they see that you’re defeated

they’re like oh yeah i got you now

i got you now now i get what i want and

i’ve finally gotten over on you so now

you are less than me an intellect like

all right okay good for you

so yeah

just uh it helps to control your

response i’ve learned that at least but

i do want to say uh joshua i believe

this is the first time we’ve had a

discussion so i do want to say i

appreciate having a chance to speak with

you today definitely look forward to

more conversations like this in the

future and if you see me on definitely

would love to have you on to converse

more because i want to get to know you

man but i do hope you take care all

right cool tell me real quick i i can

only read topics with

uh it’s malcolm or mac

all right malcolm or mac

thanks so much yeah it was a pleasure

talking and to pick up on what you said

there

very important thing um because this is

where

um you know a lot a lot of i mean just

kind of look at the spiritual side here

kind of the

viewpoint i’m looking at the most here

now

is that you know

there might be some

how can i put this

we can’t always control what happens to

us in life but where our kind of free

will comes in

where we have uh actually choice is how

we view the situation and how we respond

to it

so very important how are we framing

this how are we viewing this you know

what kind of perceptions

are evident when we’re interacting with

someone

and then how are we going to respond

because that’s where we have choice in

and say in the matter we can’t obviously

control what people are going to say or

do to us

but how are we going to view it and how

are we going to respond and so this

teaching i heard that’s helped me so

much especially when i can remember it

right

is

to

focus on our response right we can still

listen to the other person but instead

of matching their energy so what we

usually tend to do is we tend to match

the person’s energy that we’re

interacting with right because if it’s

someone condescending then you know kind

of unconsciously we think well i have to

kind of get in their mindset so i’ll be

able to relate to them or speak to them

and maybe

interact with them and do what i want to

do but so we feel we have to kind of

match where they’re at

to be able to interact with them but

that’s not the case we can listen to

them hear them but then focus our energy

and attention on how

we’re going to respond what kind of

energy and response are we going to

bring

um to what they say and this is it’s an

energetic game you know it really is an

energetic game so it’s matching the same

intensity level of energy but with the

more wholesome skillful wise response

of the energy that we want to bring

forth for our benefit for their benefit

and for the benefit of all beings

everywhere ideally right i mean

obviously we don’t beat ourselves up but

we fall short of this but the power is

in

the response

and so a lot of times when we’re not

focused on our response

then we’re just caught up in you know

dirty energy underwear is what another

teacher that calls it a lot of times um

exchanging dirty energy underwear with

other people

it’s one way to look at it

but another point that mac brought up

was

using their type of energy

[Music]

not against them but

this is actually one of these energetic

laws you know the first one is do unto

others as you’d have them do unto you

but this other one and what mac was

speaking to though and i don’t use this

very much unless i kind of have to and

where it won’t you can’t really get

through to the other person in your way

and some people that are mired in

condescension and so mired on a healing

journey that they don’t even know

they’re

under way of

um sometimes it is

um

i guess called for

to use the same kind of energy

um

so the second i guess the second law is

do unto others what they do on what they

would do what they have what they

would do unto you now the way i i kind

of and this won’t make sense for some

people and that’s okay because um

there’s other ways to do this and i only

do this kind of rarely

i’m trying i don’t even know if i want

to give an example or not but

yeah it’s really i would have to go kind

of on a case-by-case specific basis with

this it’s kind of really delicate

because that kind of approach

if you’re good at it then it can work

really well but if it’s just something

you’re kind of experimenting with i

would not recommend that because it can

it has um

a chance to backfire on you real quick

especially if you don’t know what you’re

doing you know it’s kind of like playing

with fire

but for those who know um

how to do that and do it skillfully then

it’s it’s allowed for

but the main first

thing do unto others as they as they

would do unto you that’s the big one i

mean that’s where we’re operating most

of the time

and so yeah focusing on that response

and i guess with that i guess

a lot of guessing here

i’m gonna in this and leave you all with

the optimal and ideal energy and

consciousness

to the rest of your day evening

afternoon

and night bye now